Wilfio Posted November 30, 2007 Report Share Posted November 30, 2007 i clearly said that i don't think that all Christians are extremists. i am not specifically fighting religion, i am merely fighting for rationality. i would treat you the same if you believed in Thor, Wotan, Zeus, Apollo, Bigfoot, the Boogeyman, etc. etc. It is clear to anyone that really studies it that all organised religion is a pile of rubbish, so anyone that labels themselves with one of those religions, forgive me but i just cannot take them seriously, especially if they don't have true conviction in their faith. You DO have to believe in the bible to call yourself a christian, you wouldn't know about jesus if it wasnt for the bible. you wouldn't know what jesus did if it wasn't for the bible. to believe in jesus is to believe in the bible, you cant just say that some parts of the bible are made up/ myths whereas you believe what it says about jesus. along the same lines you cannot believe in science - the theory of evolution and the fact that the earth is several billion years old specifically when the bible says otherwise. That's just plain hypocritical. if i come across as insulting i assure you that that is not my point, i merely want to raise your conciousness to the facts. and advocate that you think long and hard about what it actually is that you believe in and remove any hypocritical beliefs. believe me you can try and make me see your point of view all that you want. in fact i encourage it, if i believed that 90% of the world were going to burn in hell for all of eternity then i would want to help those people. as an added point you say we should be respectful of others beliefs yet i am sure that if someone said they believed in the flying spaghetti monster, that they took a day off every week so that they could talk to the spaghetti monster, that they sent emails in their mind to the spaghetti monster, that they had a book in which the spaghetti monster had written a bunch of commands that they must follow and that they carried them out blindly even when it conflicted with their common sense, that you would have no trouble of ridiculing them. why do you hold religion on such a pedestal? this video illustrates the qualm that i have with religious moderates http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SoSUahUmX0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JESUSfreak Posted November 30, 2007 Report Share Posted November 30, 2007 well it bothers me that they think that when i die i am going to burn in hell for all of eternity. it also makes me not like them due to their morals, if they are Christian then they must think that abortion is wrong, that gay people should be locked up etc etc. if they believe in everything the bible says then they should have intolerence to just about everybody who doesn't have exactly their beliefs. on the flip side if they don't think those things then they don't have conviction in their faith and so what is the point in labelling yourself with it in the first place? i also think that the whole idea of faith is very detrimental. lets define faith. faith is the act of believe in something without having any proof, in fact having evidence against it, yet still believing it because someone higher up in the social order told you it was true. to me that is anything but a virtue. hope that clarifies As far as abortion and being gay yes they probably think it is wrong because they believe in the Bible, but they probably also think lying is wrong, because it also says not to lie in the bible but we all lie so u decide what you want to do, but we will all be standing in front of God one day asking for forgiveness trying to enter the golden gates so the less we sin the better chance we have of getting into heaven. and Paramore just trying to make it there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilfio Posted December 1, 2007 Report Share Posted December 1, 2007 ah i see so its a selfish act as long as they get into heaven it doesnt matter if people die of geneic diseases, gay people are forced to live desperate cutoff lives and millions die in africa due to their religion not allowing them to use condoms some of us just lead the best lives we can, having the most positive influence we can. we dont need the fear of hell to make us do these things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilfio Posted December 1, 2007 Report Share Posted December 1, 2007 i see it came across as me saying i thought paramore were selfish. thats not what i meant at all, i know they are all very lovely people i was just pointing out the hypocrisy of JESUSfreak's statement for me of course the music is the most important thing but i think the bands beliefs are important too. I don't like manufactured pop music for that reason, i dont like homophobic and racist rap/urban music. I'm very glad that paramore aren't blatant with their faith but is it wrong of me to want them to lose it all together? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ive seen love die_ Posted December 1, 2007 Report Share Posted December 1, 2007 I'm very glad that paramore aren't blatant with their faith but is it wrong of me to want them to lose it all together? That's your opinion, but I don't think it's for you to decide. :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invision Posted December 1, 2007 Report Share Posted December 1, 2007 Ok Christianity is broken up into many different teachings and they all have their rules. I was born and raised Roman catholic and what i learned is that if you dont follow the bible, the ten commandments and go to church you will go to hell. Now how can Jesus he all loving and forgiving but is willing to send someone to hell for some mistakes they have made in their life. Now i'm not saying murders should go to heaven but they fact that the church is using fear in order to get people to believe in their faith is rediclious. I do believe in god but i believe that you shouldnt have to go to church every sunday. As long as you are a good person you will get into heaven. If you have made mistakes then you should be given a second chance to make things right. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions but this is what i think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JESUSfreak Posted December 1, 2007 Report Share Posted December 1, 2007 ah i see so its a selfish act as long as they get into heaven it doesnt matter if people die of geneic diseases, gay people are forced to live desperate cutoff lives and millions die in africa due to their religion not allowing them to use condoms some of us just lead the best lives we can, having the most positive influence we can. we dont need the fear of hell to make us do these things. what at all does that have to do with my post, how does them trying to get into heaven make them selfish, not care about the people dying. as far as gay people being cut off, just because they're gay doesnt mean Christians or anybody else wont talk to them or have a conversation with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JESUSfreak Posted December 1, 2007 Report Share Posted December 1, 2007 Ok Christianity is broken up into many different teachings and they all have their rules. I was born and raised Roman catholic and what i learned is that if you dont follow the bible, the ten commandments and go to church you will go to hell. Now how can Jesus he all loving and forgiving but is willing to send someone to hell for some mistakes they have made in their life. Now i'm not saying murders should go to heaven but they fact that the church is using fear in order to get people to believe in their faith is rediclious. I do believe in god but i believe that you shouldnt have to go to church every sunday. As long as you are a good person you will get into heaven. If you have made mistakes then you should be given a second chance to make things right. Everyone is entitled to their own opinions but this is what i think yes thats also what i think, and in my part of Christianity which is just Christian no babtist, catholic, or anything we believe in second chances and forgiveness for your sins, even if you have murdered if you promise not to do again and be truly apologetic, ask forgiveness you still might enter heaven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilfio Posted December 1, 2007 Report Share Posted December 1, 2007 what at all does that have to do with my post, how does them trying to get into heaven make them selfish, not care about the people dying. as far as gay people being cut off, just because they're gay doesnt mean Christians or anybody else wont talk to them or have a conversation with them. did you read the my second post? "i see it came across as me saying i thought paramore were selfish. thats not what i meant at all, i know they are all very lovely people i was just pointing out the hypocrisy of JESUSfreak's statement" to clarify, you are supporting a religion which doesnt allow the use of condoms in AIDS ridden africa, is blocking extremely important stem cell research, promotes bigotry towards gay people and is the reason why idiots like george bush are in power. not to mention the tremendous waste of time, money and natural resources. so i am putting forth that by you saying paramore (and yourself and all other christians) are just trying to get to heaven and it doesnt effect you so why do you care about it, PLEASE see the hypocrisy of that. i said it before but i am a compassionate human being and i dont need fear to make me do good things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrowncoat Posted December 2, 2007 Report Share Posted December 2, 2007 Ok, this is starting to look like a debate that's getting less and less civil and is starting to get kind of personal...and it's also way off topic from what the original question was that started it. I don't want anyone to feel insulted or excluded on the boards, so I'm going to close this thread for the time being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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