st.brittney Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 i don't have a religion, the whole point of a religion kinda scares me. i've only gone to church once, and that was to support a friend (the person who brought the most people to this speaker person got a free itunes card), and i'll admit it was one of the weirdest things i've ever experienced, and i never wanna go back. everyone in there just looked so...idk weak. like they NEEDED something to believe in, to have that feeling that someone out there is looking out for them, guiding the way. they had their hands in the air, their knees were weak, and i just wanted to run out of there lol. i'm not saying it's bad, go ahead love jesus, it's just not for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 What type of church did you go to, Brittney? If you can remember haha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st.brittney Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 christain i think lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 My bad haha, I meant like what branch of Christianity. Not like it matters too much haha, was just curious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st.brittney Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 lol, i'll ask her after this class is over (i'm at school ) cause i have no idea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted October 31, 2008 Report Share Posted October 31, 2008 It's no worries:] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krs Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 I'm not religious and I have morals. They're just not dictated to me by people who want power over me. They're my own morals, and they're based off of logic. well thats not exactly what i meant. i didnt mean that just because you're not religious you dont have morals. the point i was trying to get across is that human nature is evil. and if we didnt have religion, then people wouldnt have any incentive to be good people cuz they wont have to worry about being judged in the after life. if everyone was born good and have morals, then rules and govt wouldnt be needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanguis Dominus Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 How did you come to the conclusion that human nature is evil? People aren't born evil, it's the society we live in that make people evil. We've evolved to depend on eachother, strength in numbers and all that, millions of years ago little chimps got into groups together and travelled together and lived together. They wouldn't've survived long if they were evil towards eachother. Obviously now, that's been watered down a lot, but it's still ultimately there. Dogmatic religions take the human want to do good and twist it to their own needs. If something says "Don't kill people, don't steel, etc" then people will take that at face value and assume everything else about it is also altruistic, when in the case of religion, it's not. The good in most religions is just a facade to blind peopel to the evil they were built on. These things are built into us, the millions of people in these religions wouldn't find them as attractive if their rules included "Kill people if they don't believe the same as you." ...oh, wait. Isn't that the kind of thing "Don't kill people." is trying to cover up? If people were naturally evil, they wouldn't be duped into being evil by the false altruism in most religions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krs Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 How did you come to the conclusion that human nature is evil? People aren't born evil, it's the society we live in that make people evil. lol. human nature is evil. if EVERYONE was born like perfect little angels, then there wouldnt be EVIL people who exist. am i right? its survival of the fittest, have you not read the book "lord of the flies" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arrrrr x matey Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 i think its a mix of both. yes, people are born with certain personalities and can be evil, but their surroundings also play a big role Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 ^Agree Also, when we are born we're not necessarily "evil" we just don't know what is right or wrong. We are taught what is right and wrong when growing up, and we all have (or develop) a conscience too so I don't really think not having religions would make us evil. If anything many people could call having religions as being evil, e.g. people killing others because of their beliefs. Edit: But then again, is religion just a reason for us to fight with others, if it is ultimately human nature and "survival of the fittest"? [/debate] Don't wanna turn this thread bad or anything, just putting my opinion in there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krs Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 ok...i can see where you guys are coming from. and you both make very good points. but let me go back to my first post where someone said that we dont need religion, all we need is morals. and i just feel that we're not automatically born with the idea of having good morals. we have to be taught how to be good, like what andrew said. therefore that is why i believe human nature is evil. and i believe that it's religion that teaches people to be morally good because they fear the higher power. idk, i feel like im not explaining it very well, i have it in my head but i just cant put it into words. all in all, for me personally, as a catholic, i believe that we are natural born sinners. it's just my POV. =] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 ok...i can see where you guys are coming from.and you both make very good points. but let me go back to my first post where someone said that we dont need religion, all we need is morals. and i just feel that we're not automatically born with the idea of having good morals. we have to be taught how to be good, like what andrew said. therefore that is why i believe human nature is evil. and i believe that it's religion that teaches people to be morally good because they fear the higher power. idk, i feel like im not explaining it very well, i have it in my head but i just cant put it into words. I know what you're trying to say (I think ) I was actually thinking what about the non religious people who were taught what was right and wrong, and then thought originally that their ancestors could have been religious and that's where they got the definitions of right and wrong from, it was just passed down through family trees, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krs Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 I know what you're trying to say (I think ) I was actually thinking what about the non religious people who were taught what was right and wrong, and then thought originally that their ancestors could have been religious and that's where they got the definitions of right and wrong from, it was just passed down through family trees, etc. lol, ok yeahh i can see what you mean. but to go back to my first quesiton, if there was no religion...AT ALL, where would our morals come from then? and it's not just a question aimed at you....anyone can answer it. =] im not like a religious freak or anything, i do keep an open mind, so im interested in knowing what others think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 lol, ok yeahh i can see what you mean.but to go back to my first quesiton, if there was no religion...AT ALL, where would our morals come from then? and it's not just a question aimed at you....anyone can answer it. =] im not like a religious freak or anything, i do keep an open mind, so im interested in knowing what others think. Oh right I see, I was just rambling about something I thought of lol Difficult question, cause we're talking about from the very beginning of existence with no religion right? I think I'll just leave my answer at that Because it'd take me too long to bring up various points and stuff, and really I don't know enough about the bible or religions in general imo to put a reply up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krs Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 Oh right I see, I was just rambling about something I thought of lol Difficult question, cause we're talking about from the very beginning of existence with no religion right? I think I'll just leave my answer at that Because it'd take me too long to bring up various points and stuff, and really I don't know enough about the bible or religions in general imo to put a reply up. haha, no you made really good points. and yeah, i agree it is a difficult question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ceilidh Posted November 1, 2008 Report Share Posted November 1, 2008 Well, my parents are buddhist, and they sometimes pressure me to go to meetings and shizz But, I'm agnostic right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herewegoagain** Posted November 2, 2008 Report Share Posted November 2, 2008 I'm a Christian, an Adventist specifically Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanguis Dominus Posted November 3, 2008 Report Share Posted November 3, 2008 Here's a question. If a deity claims to be perfect, then how could that deity create something imperfect? Wouldn't the deity then be imperfect through the imperfections of its creation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lahninja Posted November 3, 2008 Report Share Posted November 3, 2008 shut up for the love of god! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanguis Dominus Posted November 3, 2008 Report Share Posted November 3, 2008 What if we don't love God? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted November 3, 2008 Report Share Posted November 3, 2008 shut up for the love of god! Best post in a religion thread so far (y) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lahninja Posted November 3, 2008 Report Share Posted November 3, 2008 ahhhh yeah (H) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheJake Posted November 3, 2008 Report Share Posted November 3, 2008 Here's a question. If a deity claims to be perfect, then how could that deity create something imperfect? Wouldn't the deity then be imperfect through the imperfections of its creation? um no. if God tried to make us perfect, but accidentally made us inperfect, then yes, that would make God imperfect, but He made us imperfect on purpose. He wanted us to have a sin nature, cus he would rather have us choose to worship him than have everyone have no sin nature and just be his robots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanguis Dominus Posted November 4, 2008 Report Share Posted November 4, 2008 He still built imperfections and flaws into us. If he was perfect, everything he created would also be perfect. It's like a machine, if a machine is in perfect working order, it can't produce something imperfectly. The only way something can be made imperfectly is if there's a flaw in the machine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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